Please educate me about Italian pens.

[tarheel1]

My humble colection is comming along nicely. By the mid to end of the month i will have 6 pens, 3 German and 3 Japanese. I have been thinking of my next pen purchase and i think i might go Italian. Problem being is i know nothing about them really. How do Italian pens compare to Japanese and German pens. How do they differentiate themselves over German and Japanese pens? How do each Italian brands compare to each other? Price wise i am looking at mid priced pens, 200-400 to start with. Thanks.

[tandaina]

Italian pens are *pretty.* While German pens tend to be black and utilitarian (though heavenly, they are my favorite) the Italians are bold and showy. I love the colors, I love the looks but I've got mixed results actually *using* them.

I've got one Visconti which is a fake piston filler (not disclosed in any literature, had to take it apart to find out), had an utterly boring nib (since reground, still a nail), and rather pretty. (If heavy and oddly balanced). I'm not a fan.

I've got a 90s era Omas with a soft gold nib that is far less showy, but in the end a better user and higher quality pen (IMO). (real piston filler, lovely nib, well balanced).

There is a Visconti thread somewhere around here you can spend days reading through for a pretty good overview of that brand. Mostly I've found the Italian pens to be very expensive compared to their German counterparts (at least the ones that catch my eye), and the results for me haven't been great. But many, many people adore them so you'll need to make up your own mind!

[john]

Italian pens are *pretty.* While German pens tend to be black and utilitarian (though heavenly, they are my favorite) the Italians are bold and showy. I love the colors, I love the looks but I've got mixed results actually *using* them.

I've got one Visconti which is a fake piston filler (not disclosed in any literature, had to take it apart to find out), had an utterly boring nib (since reground, still a nail), and rather pretty. (If heavy and oddly balanced). I'm not a fan.

I've got a 90s era Omas with a soft gold nib that is far less showy, but in the end a better user and higher quality pen (IMO). (real piston filler, lovely nib, well balanced).

There is a Visconti thread somewhere around here you can spend days reading through for a pretty good overview of that brand. Mostly I've found the Italian pens to be very expensive compared to their German counterparts (at least the ones that catch my eye), and the results for me haven't been great. But many, many people adore them so you'll need to make up your own mind!

Right, Visconti pens are great on coloration but the nibs are not good enough. After I have the Omas Milord and the Mont Blanc 146, I don't buy the Visconti anymore.

[Marsilius]

Don't miss this magisterial post:
http://fpgeeks.com/forum/showthread....ian-Pen-series

There are similar sub-forums dedicated to Italian pens.

Here:
http://www.fountainpennetwork.com/fo...-bella-italia/

and Here:
http://fountainpenboard.com/forum/index.php?/forum/30-other-european-and-asian-pens/

I am with Tandaina with thinking they are purty. I do like a nice utilitarian looking Aurora 88, though! I have a nice Delta or two but not my favorite writers. I tried an Omas once that made my mouth water, but too rich for me.

Best wishes!

[DrChumley]

I love my Italians. Some of them. And usually only after they've been adjusted. Overall, I find most of the Italian pens to have lackluster quality control when it comes to the fine-tuning of their nibs, which is a shame on pens that are so beautiful and/or expensive. Once they've been adjusted, though, they're spectacular pens. So, you may just need to plan to either do some adjustment yourself, get the pen from a company that will adjust the nib to your specifications, or be prepared to send it to a nibmeister once you get it.

Visconti has some of the most beautiful materials being used today, IMO. And the steel nibs on the Van Gogh, and Dali lines are some of the best steel nibs I've ever used. In fact, they're some of the best nibs I've ever used, period. Smooth, perfect flow. Just wonderful. I also have a pen with the "Dreamtouch" nib, which I really didn't like when I first got it. Way too wet. It's had the ink flow reduced, and I've since done some smoothing, and it's quite nice.

Omas: I only have one of these, and I love it. (I have the Notti di Bologna on Orange and Blue). The nib is super-smooth, but it required a fair bit of work to get it there. My grail pen list contains an Omas in that beautiful brown arco celluloid.

Stipula: So, I have a love/hate thing going on with Stipula at the moment. My #1 favorite pen is the Stipula Etruria Rainbow LE Demonstrator. It's the single most comfortable pen I've ever held. It's very well made, and it writes like an absolute dream. When I first got it, though, the nib had such a horrendous baby's bottom problem. I did a fair bit of work on the nib, and now it just sings. The nib on this particular pen was a 14k gold nib. A lot of their pens have titanium nibs, though, and thus far, I have been terribly unimpressed with the T-Flex nib. I don't care for it at all. Of all of these companies, I think Stipula's nib QC is probably the worst...and because of that, I probably won't try another of their pens unless someone sends it to me, despite the fact that my favorite pen is my Stipula Etruria.

Montegrappa: I've only tried one of these. It was the Espressione in one of the most beautiful blue resins I've ever seen in my life. Unfortunately, it wasn't a great fit in my hand, the metal section was horribly uncomfortable for me, and as seems to be a running theme, the nib was scratchy. Ended up returning that one and getting something else instead. I would still like to try more Montegrappa, but I won't buy any more of them until I've held them in my hand to see how they feel.

Granted, I'm making it sound like all of these pens needed work, and for most part they did. However, I should note that I adjust almost every single one of my pens when I get it. I can rarely use a pen right out of the box.

[HeresyHammer]

After living in Rome for four years, Italian pens have a special place in my heart. Many of the Italian pens are absolutely stunning. It seems that Visconti and Delta are always trying to one-up each other and nothing bad seems to have come from healthy competition.

The way I describe Italian pens: Imagine a working meeting where all the great Italian pen designers get together and begin talking at the same time. (Much like around an Italian dinner table) They argue, they philosophize, they pull their collective minds, they rely on centuries of art and inspiration. Color swatches, materials, metals, etc. are all brought up and shouted down simultaneously. When the final draft is completed, they have designed, once again, the most beautiful thing that anyone has ever seen and then... someone says, "don't forget, we have to make this thing write too." Beauty first, functionality second. Their pens are an extension of who they are. The same peoples who built St. Peter's Basilica also have a government bureaucracy that makes a trip to an American DMV seems like a vacation to Disney World.

[Paragraph Removed]*

Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Italian fountain pens. I just bought a Delta Dolcevita at the DC Pen Show. It's like writing with a stick of sidewalk chalk! But with that baby in hand, all other pens seem to bow in homage to its magnificence. Yet, for all their beauty, Italian fountain pens are divas. They work when they want to work and no amount of fighting with them will change their mind. You just have to understand that when buying Italian fountain pens, they will always remain beautiful and when they choose to sing, it will bring tears to you eyes.

-----

* Paragraph rescinded for seemingly raciest generalization against my own ethnicity. I deeply apologize for offending all of us who are Italian. It is certain that not all Italians would choose to look good rather than to feel good. I’m sure there are as many us who choose comfort over fashion, as those who choose fashion over comfort. Style is a personal choice that cannot be reduced to mere generalizations of race, color, religion, creed, gender, national origin, disability, marital, or veteran status, or any other legally protected status. I meant no disrespect to our rich Italian heritage and I humbly ask our pardon.

[amk]

I am not a great lover of modern Italian pens (with the exception of the Delta dolce vita which I think is magnificent). The celluloids are lovely, but there is too much bling, they're too expensive, and the nibs are not always as good as you'd expect.

BUT

I have managed to acquire a few second tier vintage Italian pens - Astura, 'Contessa', Palladiana, Columbus. Mainly as a result of job lots and occasionally from FPN. And I love them. They are not blingy - except for the celluloid, wonderfully deep, mysteriously translucent. It's quite different from anything you find in Germany or US/UK or even France - there's a certain quality to it, a hard surface shine and a depth of colour I can't find elsewhere. Maybe I've just been lucky :-) - but in any case I'm going to go on keeping my eyes open for these old Italians. I'm never going to *collect* them, you understand, but I won't say no if occasionally one wanders my way. :-)

[snedwos]

This reminds me of something the guys on top gear said about Alfa Romeos. They are very beautiful, and they will, for a short period of time, be everything a car should be... Then they break down. As with cars, so with pens?

Tarheel, you need to talk to Tracy Lee.

[AltecGreen]

I am not a great lover of modern Italian pens (with the exception of the Delta dolce vita which I think is magnificent). The celluloids are lovely, but there is too much bling, they're too expensive, and the nibs are not always as good as you'd expect.

BUT

I have managed to acquire a few second tier vintage Italian pens - Astura, 'Contessa', Palladiana, Columbus. Mainly as a result of job lots and occasionally from FPN. And I love them. They are not blingy - except for the celluloid, wonderfully deep, mysteriously translucent. It's quite different from anything you find in Germany or US/UK or even France - there's a certain quality to it, a hard surface shine and a depth of colour I can't find elsewhere. Maybe I've just been lucky :-) - but in any case I'm going to go on keeping my eyes open for these old Italians. I'm never going to *collect* them, you understand, but I won't say no if occasionally one wanders my way. :-)

This is why I stopped buying modern Italians and started collecting vintage Italians.

BTW-Columbus is a first tier company before 1952.

[Ian]

I picked up my first Delta last weekend at the Washington DC pen show. It is one of the limited edition Hawaii pens from the Indigenous People series. I really love the looks of the pen an how it writes. It is the best pen I picked up at a the show. I got a great price from Fahrneys. I have looked at several other Deltas online since the show and I have realized you should never pay full price for Delta pens. I think you should look for at least 30% off. I ordered a Delta pen that was 60% off Sunday night. In your price range you may enjoy the mid-size Dolce Vita in orange and black. It is a beautiful pen that lists for $595, but it sells on eBay for $300.

[Bogon07]

Ian, congratulations on your Delta Indigenous Hawaii pen. It is gorgeous looking pen.

Tarheel1 - Visconti for steel nibs the Rembrandt is better value than the modern VanGogh, Dali, Michelangelo or Venus Botticelli with same steel nib & feed.
for 14/18K gold nibs an older Voyager c/c is a good pen with a nice range of acrylics & I think it feels better balanced than the Operas which replaced it.
They pop up regularly on eBay - some new old stock. There are also more expensive power filler versions too.

[tarheel1]

If I got the dali it would have the 23k Palladium nib

[sixbynineis42]

If I got the dali it would have the 23k Palladium nib

The user-level Dali has a steel nib. I don't know what the LE Dali comes with.

[Silverbreeze]

If I got the dali it would have the 23k Palladium nib

The user-level Dali has a steel nib. I don't know what the LE Dali comes with.

I believe the LEs are Pd, you can always get a Pd nib from the distributor if you get the Standard

[tarheel1]

If I got the dali it would have the 23k Palladium nib

The user-level Dali has a steel nib. I don't know what the LE Dali comes with.

I believe the LEs are Pd, you can always get a Pd nib from the distributor if you get the Standard

Yes you can get the pd nib on the standard.

[sixbynineis42]

Yes you can get the pd nib on the standard.

Just FYI, if the Dali with the Pd nib is something you're considering...he best price I've found on the Dali is $195, and will cost you $200 or more for a Pd nib. Currently Chatterley Luxuries is selling the Cherry Juice Opera with your choice of Pd nib for $225.

[Bogon07]

The Rembrandt & the faceted barrel VanGogh, Dali, Michelangelo & Unity of Italy plus the Ragtime use the smaller #4 Visconti nib.
The Opera, the expensive LE Dali powerfiller & most other Visconti pens use the larger #6 nib.

[jar]

Nuff said.

[Misfit]

Love love love my Visconti Homo Sapiens with stub nib bought from Chatterly (pentime.com).
I have a Visconti Michelangelo with medium nib that writes well. Also have a Visconti LE Wall Street with stub nib that writes well. Plus a Michelangelo back in black broad nib I haven't used yet

I have one Delta Gallery Blue Moon with stub nib that writes well.

Now, some Visconti FP don't like neglect. So if I haven't used the HS for a few days, it won't write until I get a little water on the nib. But so far I've had good luck with the Visconti nibs.

[youstruckgold]

A few of my Omas celluloids: