Vintage Collectors? Share your experience.

[logantrky]

Hello all

As you've seen earlier, I have been strictly a modern MB collector. However, I am considering moving into the vintage world. For those of you that have both modern and vintage MB pens, I would be interested to know which you prefer collecting. Have you been disappointed with your vintage purchases or have you found them to surpass your expectations, even among your modern pens? I would like to hear your stories.

[jar]

I don't have any vintage MBs but I do have some from the 40s and 50s. Those have been very nice, certainly as nice as my Sheaffers, Parkers, Watermans, Conway Stewarts, Swans and Onotos from that period and I see no reason even older MBs wouldn't be as nice as my other pens from the 10s, 20s and 30s.

BUT... as with so many things you really need to know what you are looking at.

[logantrky]

Thanks, jar.

Perhaps I wasn't quite clear. When I say "vintage" I suppose I mean pens from the early teens-the 70s. There might be another term that would work better, but the word "vintage" was the only one that came to my mind.

[jar]

Well, I'd say that in the case of 70s Montblancs I see almost no differences in terms of performance, feel, major construction features or much any other area when compared to the pens being made today.

Now the pens form the late 50s through late 60s were quite different, slim, flat ended, inset semi-hooded nibs, but still there was a full range of products from the 3x and 3xx entry level to the 1x and 1xx top of the line.



These pens were about the same size at the Parker 75 or "61".



When you take another step back and look at the pens from the late 40s into the mid to late 50s though you see another transition, from the dome top look towards the cigar shape that had been introduced about a quarter century earlier by Sheaffer with the Balance pens. There is still a full range of pens from top end to entry level but Montblanc was also testing different designs and nibs and capping systems. Some examples of the older more conservative designs like the 234½ were still available but there is also the cigar shaped 14x, 24x, 34x designs and the revolutionary for MB 25x series with the winged nib and slip on cap and the semi-conservative 264 with screw cap and open nib.



With celluloid bodies and slightly smaller sizes than you see today, there is quite a difference when it comes to personality, look and feel.

Here you can see a modern 146 and 50s 146 on the far right and the 50s is considerably smaller.



The wing nib on the 25x series is among the most flexible MB nibs I've used. This is on a 254, but the 25x series were prone to cap cracking and so finding one like this is getting harder every day.





One thing I really like are the concave sections seen above and found on the 14x pens from the period. Surprisingly though the 149 at the time had a straight section.

[Fawkes]

I collect both the modern and vintage MBs. In all honesty, I prefer the vintage ones over today's offering, at least in the standard range. I love a lot of the Writer's Editions and LEs but that's about it. I have yet to be disappointed with any of my vintage purchases as I try to buy the best I can afford and often in restored condition. I find the vintage ones more comfortable to use with the often concave section found on the old 12X, 13x, 14x, etc. series. The steel nibs found on a lot of the wartime or post-war era pens in my collection are the best nibs I have ever used. Smooth, very flexible, elegant looking. The feeds are often excellent, too, always keeping up with the ink flow demands and never has a nib rail-roaded. The 138 in my collection is the best pen I own, both vintage and modern. Incredibly comfortable, the perfect size, great nib/feed and build quality, plus the telescopic piston takes in a huge amount of ink. My 138 is a medium nib and with a full fill will last over 2 weeks of daily writing.

I hope this little rant helps.

[logantrky]

Thanks for the informative post with pictures, jar! What year was the 146 with the concave section? The wing nib looks quite interesting as well!

Fawkes: Your collection sounds quite interesting! I appreciate the time you took to explain your collection. Have you posted pictures anywhere of your favorite vintage MB pens? I would be interested in seeing them. I may have to study some more about the 138.

[jar]

Thanks for the informative post with pictures, jar! What year was the 146 with the concave section? The wing nib looks quite interesting as well!

That one is likely mid 50s since it has a ski-slope feed with the grooves. I also have an even earlier one that has the ski-slope feed but no grooves.

The wing nib 25x pens are great ... BUT the caps were very prone to cracking and so one like that one with pristine body and cap are getting harder and harder to find.

I'll try get some pictures of some 234½s with comparisons to other pens for you tomorrow.

[tandaina]

70s and 80s? Eh, might as well buy modern. 40s and 50s MB wins hands down every time with me. I wouldn't trade my third their 50s pens for a modern pen. The nibs are just a whole other world, one I vastly prefer!

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Tapatalk 4 Beta

[logantrky]

Thanks for the informative post with pictures, jar! What year was the 146 with the concave section? The wing nib looks quite interesting as well!

That one is likely mid 50s since it has a ski-slope feed with the grooves. I also have an even earlier one that has the ski-slope feed but no grooves.

The wing nib 25x pens are great ... BUT the caps were very prone to cracking and so one like that one with pristine body and cap are getting harder and harder to find.

I'll try get some pictures of some 234½s with comparisons to other pens for you tomorrow.

Wow, thanks jar! This has been very informative for me. I admit I am nearly ignorant about vintage MBs, but I'm slowly learning. Posts like the one you posted have helped me greatly!


Tandaina: I have heard this from others as well, concerning 50s MBs. We would love to see them!

[jar]

The 234½ were the last of the dome top pens to survive. In about 1948 IIRC MB discontinued all the other dome top versions as they moved to the today more familiar cigar shapes.

Here you can see a couple 234½ pens next to an early 144 and an early Pelikan M-400.



The 234½ with the single wide cap band was called the "Luxury" model and other than the caps being different (length, furniture, threading, snow cap) there is little difference.

[logantrky]

So is the 234 1/2 Luxury a more limited run than the regular 234 1/2? Also, I saw one 234 1/2G. Does this mean that it is a gold nib, rather than something else, like plated steel?

Great pictures!

[jar]

So is the 234 1/2 Luxury a more limited run than the regular 234 1/2? Also, I saw one 234 1/2G. Does this mean that it is a gold nib, rather than something else, like plated steel?

Great pictures!

There's been some discussion about what the significance of the "G" in MB models meant. Personally I think it varied over time. For example early pens had the "G" signifying a plain smooth finish instead of machined but I have also seen the "G" used to signify a gold nib on models that came with either steel or gold nibs.



I have seen 234½ nibs with no size markings like these two and also with 4½ in the center.

[AtomicLeo]

Beware Ebay. I bought a 24 off of ebay, knowing it needed restoration. However the cracked section could not be repaired. The pen is usable but leaks on my fingers. I LOVE the nib and have been on the look out for a restored 24 ever since.

[logantrky]

Thanks again, jar. That nib is scrumptious! Out of curiosity, how have you acquired all this knowledge about MB fountain pens? Is it purely from reading forums?

Also to you, Leo. That is good information to keep for the future!

So does anyone have an opinion of what the most collected vintage MB is? In other words, what are the "must-haves" for a vintage MB collector?

[jar]

Thanks again, jar. That nib is scrumptious! Out of curiosity, how have you acquired all this knowledge about MB fountain pens? Is it purely from reading forums?

What little I know is mostly from being wrong about what I know decade after decade for over a half century.

So does anyone have an opinion of what the most collected vintage MB is? In other words, what are the "must-haves" for a vintage MB collector?

I don't think there are any Must Haves, we each have different likes and dislikes. I tend to like the #4 size pens and so I own quite a few of them from many, many different manufacturers and periods.

[Fawkes]

Thanks for the informative post with pictures, jar! What year was the 146 with the concave section? The wing nib looks quite interesting as well!

Fawkes: Your collection sounds quite interesting! I appreciate the time you took to explain your collection. Have you posted pictures anywhere of your favorite vintage MB pens? I would be interested in seeing them. I may have to study some more about the 138.

I only have pictures floating around here and FPN of my 138 and 236. If I get the time to take pics of my others I'll be sure to post them here for you.

[sunnerd]

First post here in this forum, but I've been with FPN for several years.
I, like Fawkes, have both modern and vintage MB pens, and I concur that the steel nibs during WW2 are the best, even better than the Palladium nibs as well as the 14C (not 14K) nibs.
As for the lines to get, I would say for a start do look at the 13x, while their prices are ridiculously expensive, I believe their values will only appreciate.
Also, look out for the pattern pens e.g. Coral colour, Platinum Lined, Tiger eyes, green striated / grey striated, and green/grey/blue marbled pens.
BTW, ebay is ok as long as you know what you're doing and the seller has strong ratings. Going to pen shows is a very useful way in getting into vintage pens, also the same motto applies - only deal with well known dealers.

Hope this helps. Do note that getting into vintage pens is a slippery slope.

Some of my 30/40s and patterned pens.

Left to right - 139L (Palladium nib, short ink window), 139G (long ink window), 138 (Palladium nib), 136 (gold plated steel nib), transitional 136, transitional 136 half demo (already with 14x cap band), 134, 132 (Palladium nib), 234 1/2 G, 234 1/2G (I couldn't help it at a pen show even though I got one 234 1/2 already...)


Left to right - 146 green striated, 144 grey straited, 72G platinum line pencil, 234 1/2 platinum line, 244 green marbled, 246 green marbled, 172G Coral pencil, #30 Coral, #25 Coral (cap lip cracked and got a replacement that doesn't look really fitting :-(), #20 Coral.

[Fawkes]

Wow, sunnerd, that is quite the collection! I love the 136 half demo and that 234 1/2 PL is amazing.

[logantrky]

That is quite a collection indeed! Thanks for sharing, sunnerd!

It's good to see you over here as well.

[cnjackson]

Hi Jar--are the cracks in the caps of 25Xs primarily an aesthetic concern, or something more serious?

And can you say something about why the wing nibs are so special?

Thank you!

Chris